We’re linking daily to selected audio / video files from our YouTube channel. Today’s file is here (video, 42:15).
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Month: May 2023
Janice Fiamengo: (Never) Blame Feminism
Outstanding. I’ve posted a brief comment and would encourage you to do likewise to show support for this stellar commentator on gender issues, to my mind the most important female anti-feminist MRA commentator in the world.
She will be the keynote speaker at the next ICMI I’ll be hosting, in Budapest in August 2024. Also speaking will be Paul Elam, Professor Stephen Baskerville, William Collins, two British MPs, Gerry Alexander (check out his ICMI20 and ICMI21 videos), and more.
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‘One woman never got a penny of ex’s £1.2m retirement fund’: Women get a TENTH of what they’re owed from divorce as lawyers forget pension pots
Our thanks to Ken for this. Women’s greed following divorce knows no limits. Any man in the UK – and many other developed countries – who marries a woman today (and indeed for many years past) is, in my view, clinically insane.
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The Scottish government’s CONsultation on reforming the criminal law to address misogyny
The Scottish feminist barrister Helena Kennedy, Baroness Kennedy of The Shaws has been chairing the Scottish government’s Working Group on Misogyny. Our thanks to Len for sending us this link to Chapter 4 of the related CONsultation document. He writes:
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This consultation finishes next Thursday night. You will need to check if any J4MB communications could fall foul of the legislation, which has long prison sentences attached (and if necessary, respond to the consultation and raise awareness of the legislation being drafted). [J4MB – we shall not be checking anything in relation to this ludicrous initiative, and responding to government CONsulations are always an exercise in utter futility.] Of particular interest to website and Twitter users are the proposed ‘stirring up’ offences. Not least because of the seven-year prison sentences attached to the proposed offence. There are some free speech provisions in the proposals, but activists need to be sure these are sufficient, and the legislation could become more restrictive with passage through the Scottish Assembly. All of the proposals are of concern because they propose it would be legal for one gender to say or communicate something about the other, which would be illegal the other way around (gender exclusive legal protection) and some of the provisions are widely drafted, and ambiguous in application. I’ve had a quick look at the consultation document, there are four questions for respondents:From the document, the entirety of Chapter 4, with my emphases and comments:I’m having a brief look now at Chapter 4 of the consultation, which discusses this offence, but please don’t disregard the other three offences, each of which had its own chapter in the consultation paper.
- Do you agree there should be an offence?
- Do you agree it should be committed where a person behaves in a threatening or abusive manner, or communicates threatening or abusive material?
- Do you have any comments on freedom of expression?
- Do you have any other comments on the draft offence?
Recommendation: An offence of Stirring Up Hatred Against Women and Girls At the end of the chapter, there is a draft provision indicating how the Scottish Government have developed the recommendation into draft law. The text below provides a summary of what the report recommended, key issues in the development of the draft provision and questions. Readers may wish to consider the text below in conjunction with the draft provision before considering the questions.What the report recommends
The report recommends that an offence of stirring up hatred against women and girls should be created. It proposes that it should criminalise engaging in threatening or abusive behaviour, or communicating threatening or abusive material, with the intention of stirring up hatred towards women and girls. The report notes that the offence should not require there to be a specific victim and as such the question of whether any individual targeted by a perpetrator is or is not a woman or girl is not relevant as the offence relates to stirring up hatred of women as a group. [J4MB emphasis] The report notes that freedom of expression must be considered in determining whether the behaviour or communication was reasonable, but that no one should enjoy the freedom to stir up hatred towards women. [J4MB emphasis]Discussion
The report recommends that an offence of stirring up of hatred of against women and girls should be created to address: “a rapidly growing culture, with far reaching impacts, of stirring up hatred towards women…which causes women, as a group, to feel vulnerable and excluded” [J4MB emphasis. Got it. The whole driver of this legislation is one of countless feminist myths.] The report cites examples of how the offence may be committed such as an ‘incel’ who encourages his social media followers to assault women who refuse to have sex with men who have taken them on a date, and an extremist religious preacher who advocates physical punishment of women who have sex outside of marriage. The 2021 Act will, when it comes into effect, provide for offences of ‘stirring up hatred’. The offences cover stirring up hatred on grounds of race, age, disability, religion, sexual orientation, transgender identity and variations in sex characteristics. In the 2021 Act, the test used for the offence covering all characteristics except race[1] is as follows. This offence is committed where a person behaves in a manner, or communicates material to another person, that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, and, in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on their membership of a group defined by one of these listed characteristics. [J4MB emphasis] It may be worth noting that the number of prosecutions for existing ‘stirring up hatred’ offences in different jurisdictions across the UK is very low (typically between 5 and 15 across the whole of the UK per year) and it is reasonable to expect that this will also be the case for the offence of stirring up hatred of women and girls. It is possible that behaviour which amounts to the stirring up of hatred against women and girls may often take a slightly different form from the stirring up of hatred against groups covered by the existing offences. The report notes that “often this stirring up of hatred presents as being hatred of a particular type of woman – a noisy woman, a successful woman, an opinionated woman. But the crime is about female identity. It is no defence to say “I only hate certain kinds of woman – feminists, fat women or unfeminine women…” [J4MB emphasis. This is priceless, and of course most feminists are fat and unfeminine too. But since when was it a crime to hate people of different political persuasions to yourself? I’m reminded of the quotation usually wrongly attributed to Voltaire, “To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.”] This may contrast with stirring up of hatred against groups defined by their racial or religious identity or sexual orientation, where, for the most part, people who stir up hatred against these groups target the group in its entirety, rather than stirring up hatred against, for example, people of a particular racial identity who dress in a certain way, people of a particular religious faith who hold certain opinions, or people of a particular sexual orientation who are ‘too loud’. However, the ‘stirring up hatred’ offence in the 2021 Act is wide enough to criminalise stirring up of hatred that takes this form, providing the stirring up of hatred relates specifically to the members of one of the protected groups. The draft offence of stirring up of hatred against women and girls works in the same way. There is likely to be a degree of overlap between the types of behaviour that amount to an offence of ‘stirring up hatred of women and girls’ and the proposed offences of ‘misogynistic harassment’ and ‘misogynistic behaviour’ discussed earlier in the consultation. However, there is nonetheless a good case for legislating for a stirring up hatred against women and girls offence. [J4MB emphasis] The offences of misogynistic harassment and misogynistic behaviour are concerned with the direct effect of behaviour on women and girls towards whom it is directed, or who may see or hear it. By contrast, behaviour intended to stir up hatred against women and girls may take place in all-male spaces, either on or off-line and is concerned with the effect that the behaviour has on the (probably male) people in whom the perpetrator is seeking to stir up hatred of women and girls. [J4MB emphasis] There is acute societal concern about online content, in particular, which glorifies the abuse of women and which the existing law is unable to deal with effectively. This behaviour may not amount to misogynistic harassment offence or misogynistic behaviour offence if there are no women or girls present who may be directly harmed by it. As such, the stirring up hatred offence is focused on behaviour that seeks to stir up hatred in others against women and girls rather than any behaviour that is necessarily directed at, or takes place in the vicinity of, women and girls. In this regard, it is worth noting that the 2021 Act provides for both an offence of stirring up racial hatred and a separate offence of racially aggravated harassment which demonstrates the different policy aims of stirring up hatred offences and offences concerned with e.g. harassment or abusive behaviour more generally type which is directly experienced by its victims. Question: Do you agree with the report’s recommendation that there should be an offence of stirring up hatred of women and girls?The behaviour to be covered by the offence – section 1(1)
The report recommends adopting the approach taken for the general stirring up of hatred offence contained in the 2021 Act. The ‘stirring up of hatred of women and girls’ offence has been drafted on this basis. What this means is that the offence of stirring up hatred of women and girls is committed where the accused behaves in a threatening or abusive manner, or communicates threatening or abusive material, and, in either case, has the intention of stirring up hatred against women and girls. A ‘reasonableness’ defence modelled on that contained in the 2021 Act has also been provided for. The maximum penalty on conviction on indictment is 7 years imprisonment, in line with the offences of stirring up hatred in the 2021 Act. [J4MB emphasis] Question: Do you agree with the report’s recommendation that the offence should be committed where a person behaves in a threatening or abusive manner or communicates threatening or abusive material, with the intention of stirring up hatred of women and girls?Freedom of expression (section 2)
The report states that “Freedom of expression must be considered in determining whether the behaviour or communication was reasonable e.g. arguing against feminism, but no-one should enjoy freedom to stir up hatred towards women.” [J4MB emphasis. Arguing against feminism will inevitably stir up hatred of feminists in some, and not unreasonably, given the destruction feminists have created and sustain.] It is a defence to the stirring up hatred offences contained in the 2021 Act for a person charged with an offence under this section to show that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable. This was included as a safeguard, albeit as regards the offences requiring an intent to stir up hatred, it is difficult to envisage when the accused’s actions would ever be reasonable. The stirring up offence is limited to behaviour or communications which are threatening or abusive and intended to stir up hatred of women and girls. The purpose of the offence is not to interfere with a person’s ability to freely debate issues concerning, or relating to, women and girls. [JMB emphasis. Orwellian doublespeak. The offence IS designed to interfere with a person’s ability to…] In light of concerns raised during the passage of the 2021 Act, we have included a provision to address this which is similar to that contained within section 9 of the 2021 Act. This provision makes clear the following: For the avoidance of doubt, behaviour or material is not to be taken to be threatening or abusive solely on the basis that it involves or includes discussion or criticism of issues relating to women and girls. This ensures, for the avoidance of doubt, that discussion or criticism of, for example, equal pay for women or the right to maternity leave would not, in and of itself, be considered to be (threatening or) abusive. Something more is required for any such discussion or criticism to be taken to be threatening or abusive. For example, if it were proved that a reasonable person would consider that the criticism was expressed in a threatening or abusive way, or the material containing the criticism also included other threatening or abusive comments, it could still be taken to be behaviour or material that is threatening or abusive and therefore satisfy the first element of the offence. For the offence to be committed, however, the second element (i.e., the intention to stir up hatred) would also have to be proved beyond reasonable doubt. Question: Do you have any comments on the proposed approach to freedom of expression set out in the draft provisions? Question: Do you have any other comments on the draft offence of stirring up hatred of women and girls?Draft Provision
1 Offence of stirring up hatred against women and girls
(1) A person commits an offence if— (a) the person— (i) behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, or (ii) communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, and (b) in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against women and girls. (2) It is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to show that the behaviour or the communication was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable. (3) For the purposes of subsection (2), it is shown that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable if— (a) evidence adduced is enough to raise an issue as to whether that is the case, and (b) the prosecution does not prove beyond reasonable doubt that it is not the case. (4) For the purposes of subsection 1(a)(i), a person’s behaviour— (a) includes behaviour of any kind, and in particular, things that the person says, or otherwise communicates, as well as things that the person does, (b) may consist of— (i) a single act, or (ii) a course of conduct. (5) For the purposes of subsection (1)(a)(ii), the ways in which a person may communicate material to another person are by— (a) displaying, publishing or distributing the material, (b) giving, sending, showing or playing the material to another person, (c) making the material available to another person in any other way. (6) A person who commits an offence under this section if liable— (a) on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum (or both), or (b) on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or a fine (or both). (7) In this section— “material” means anything that is capable of being looked at, read, watched or listened to, either directly or after conversion from data stored in another form, “women and girls” includes women or girls (or both)— (a) of a particular description or who are members of a particular group, (b) who are presumed by the offender to be of a particular description or members of a particular group.2 Protection of freedom of expression for the purposes of the offence of stirring up hatred against women and girls
For the purposes of section 1, behaviour or material is not to be taken to be threatening or abusive solely on the basis that it involves or includes discussion or criticism of matters relating to women and girls.
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Audio / video #143 from our archives: ICMI16 – Karen Straughan, ‘Toxic Femininity’
We’re linking daily to selected audio / video files from our YouTube channel. Today’s file is here (video, 45:16).
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SARAH VINE: Why would any man strive for the top when an innocent compliment can destroy him?
Our thanks to Mike P for this.
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‘This could happen to you too’… After being forced out as Tesco chairman over flimsy, anonymous allegations for which there isn’t a shred of evidence, John Allan gives an interview to shock all who believe in innocent until proven guilty
Our thanks to Jeff for this.
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PETER HITCHENS: If rape cases are to be heard without juries, how long before we scrap them altogether – just like Hitler and the Bolsheviks did?
Our thanks to Jeff for this.
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Men share harrowing stories of abuse at hands of partners at historic conference in Belfast
Interesting.
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Audio / video #142 from our archives: ICMI16 – Mark Pearson, ‘Facing my Waterloo’
We’re linking daily to selected audio / video files from our YouTube channel. Today’s file is here (video, 39:11).
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Justice for Men & Boys 